Another question

[Ever]

I notice no devs replied to our last thread, and we can take a hint, so we'll keep it simple.

Kusanagi's been bitching about overpowered vampires from the beginning, and I agreed, but I didn't think it was quite as serious an issue. In a game like this, one team will always be better than the other. In VS the Slayers had more power, the vampires took a little more skill, and it all worked out. But I looked through our screenshot folder, and for round-based games it turns out neither one of us has ever played in one that didn't end with the vampires having more rounds won than slayers. And it's not a narrow margin, either - we're talking differences like 15-5, 20-2. I understand that Kusanagi's personal experience of having vastly different ratios as a slayer/vampire isn't compelling evidence - but this kind of pattern definitely is. Also note that the vampires have this edge even with the swipes being totally broken. How devastating are they going to be when they actually have their hits register consistently?

So our question is this: do you, the devs, understand and acknowledge this problem, or deny it? It's fine if you deny it; it wouldn't be the first time - but Kusanagi and I'd like to know whether to keep analyzing, or to just shut up and watch how it turns out. There are a lot of smaller things we'd like to comment on, but the central, fundamental imbalance seems like a better place to start.

[Renaissance]

Hmm,

I'll approach this delicately as you do seem dismayed. We feel things are more balanced than you do. There are of course always tweaks that can be made, but it has been our personal experience that the outcome of a game is really more dependent on the players playing. Slayer team takes more team work, Vampires a little more individual flair. This is by design. We also approach this game from the perspective that we LIKE challenges. I LOVE a desperate situation that's almost unfair and panic enducing, THATS THE JUICE MAN

I know you both feel things are horribly imbalanced at a fundamental level, and apparently that hits don't register properly? On this point I do remember you mentioning this and the answer was given in game, the vampire melee range is as it is for a reason. At the point you asked the slayers were destroying the vampires, with me out front as a Reaver, the Reaver class being something that "will never work" as another of your major complaints.

As for the snide remark about us ignoring things? I don't know what to say to that. All I can say is practice, as this always helps out balance. It's a fight to the death between Slayers and Vampires, anything can happen on any given day. For a new player Slayer team can be difficult until you realize you best stick to your group.

And on a final note, this game is new to, well everyone. So we do have to take it with a grain of salt when someone with less than 1/100 the time "tinkering" with it that we have, claims to have the big answer to fix the game, or that it's just plain broken.

I hope you don't feel ignored, and I of course hope you continue to enjoy Coven, but yes for now your suggestion (while I wouldn't suppose to be so rude as to tell you to shut up) to yourselves of "wait and see", I think is the best one

Glad you like the Mod enough to think about it in your free time

Ren

[Ever]

Relax, bro. Nobody's dismayed. Nothing snide. Nobody claimed a big fix, either. You don't have to know the right answer to be able to spot the wrong one. Patterns don't lie.

A lot of work goes into a mod - it's like writing a book, or filming a movie. You can get attached to what you're doing, which can make you resistant to change. Is a mod team that sticks to its guns obstinate, or just dedicated to its vision? Bad design choices happen, not just in mods, but in commercial games. But they're even harder to identify and eliminate in a mod, because it's not just a bad idea - it's OUR bad idea, into which we've put a great deal of work and are very attached. If I come in here and tell you that you have one too many slayer classes and that you need to eliminate one, whether I'm right or not, you're going to balk at the idea - I would too - because by taking one of them out you might make Coven a better game, but it wouldn't be the same Coven that you've spent years lovingly creating. Believe me, we get it. We've seen it before.

Please understand we just wanted to know up front if we're wasting our breath. In spite of its inexplicable name, Coven has potential, and we're both big fans of Vampire Slayer. We'll be sure to give the game another try when it's finished. Thanks for taking the time to answer. And nicely. It's not every day you meet a nice mod team.

[Renaissance]

Hm,

Gosh I guess there is just a disconnect in personal socialization styles here, you still came off "better than" or something. And I too have seen that before. Tip: "snide" or "rude" are in the ear of the beholder, not the mouth of the speaker. We are a nice mod team. We do this in our spare time out of love for it, and the gameplay. At my age "pride" is kinda passe. When it plays well and is fun, that's my yardstick.

But we do hope to see you around and enjoying the game.

Everything I said before stands.

Thanks, and sorry you've had such bad luck with mods.

Ren